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Right,

Seeing as for some reason, I still find myself playing scrims on the old version of Backlot even though the new one is up and working. I think it's time to come up with a tactic to be able to deploy there maps to servers and spread the word to get these maps added to pools.

Can people talk to server hosting companies, I mean Vita Nova can mention it to Immortal Servers to try and get these maps added to the servers when they get purchased or whatever.

Can we just come up with a couple of deployment ideas and then start moving forwards, I just keep seeing maps creeping up, talks about adding them to the pool and then nothing happen.

Discuss...
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5.9 years ago
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+1

Could have a thread explaining how to install the maps on the server as well, we've got cluster on the server but for som reason it would make people download it even if we're not playing on it.

I think the maps which should be added are cluster and backlot_fix for now, although marketcenter is looking really good.

Imo urban and hideout are unplayable
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Could write a guide on installing maps on a local machine, I'm not 100% on how they work in servers but I'm guessing there wouldn't be too much difference.

If it where up to me, I would just set a deadline to confirm the maps that are going to be placed in rotation, any that are not ready etc will be moved back to another months deadline.

e.g.
End of August:
backlot_fix is ready for implementation
mp_marketcentre is ready for implementation

End of September:
mp_urban released new beta
mp_hideout released final beta

Those two get added to the pool in an update through CG with a news post linking to the download and the two guides to install them onto your server, they get added to the ladders and then we work from there, these are obviously going to fade out when you are playing IRC games but it should, and I use the term lightly make people use the LF scrim system that is on the website.
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Lots of maps, some of which are good, being made... but not enough effort being put into getting them in the map pool. Agree with you, a lot of people need to put work into getting them played more often and work on putting them in leagues and ladders etc.

Needs to be a bit more teamwork when it comes to the final stages of each of the maps, everyones to quick to put reasons as to why maps should and shouldnt be played.
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I just wish all stock maps were in promod rotation. Would bring alot of depth to the game. :<
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Quote from P-MAN on the 13th of August 2011:
Lots of maps, some of which are good, being made... but not enough effort being put into getting them in the map pool. Agree with you, a lot of people need to put work into getting them played more often and work on putting them in leagues and ladders etc.

Needs to be a bit more teamwork when it comes to the final stages of each of the maps, everyones to quick to put reasons as to why maps should and shouldnt be played.

There are too many people putting their fingers in the pie when creating a map is concerned.

There should be specific guidelines to how maps should be created and added, can you imagine from a map makers perspective, everyone throwing there opinion in the mix makes it impossible to get a final result.

There should be a panel of about 15/20 people testing the map, who are high up and have had years (and I mean YEARS!) of experience playing CoD4 competitive because lets be honest, they are the only people that will have a valid opinion on what a map needs. Everyone else should just be made to play it, simple as that.

Then a deadline should be placed once the final beta has been released, then just implement that after that deadline.
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Quote from SNWZY3 on the 13th of August 2011:
There should be a panel of about 15/20 people testing the map


This.

End of the day, like you say, needs people who know what theyre on about. And this scene is pretty sheepish, lets be honest... big names play new maps, everyone else jumps on the bandwagon. Just needs to be less whiney, you can dislike a map but it still be competitive.
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Quote from SNWZY3 on the 13th of August 2011:
There are too many people putting their fingers in the pie when creating a map is concerned.

There should be specific guidelines to how maps should be created and added, can you imagine from a map makers perspective, everyone throwing there opinion in the mix makes it impossible to get a final result.
This is why I've barely touched cluster, I don't know what to do with the map.
Quote from SNWZY3 on the 13th of August 2011:
There should be a panel of about 15/20 people testing the map, who are high up and have had years (and I mean YEARS!) of experience playing CoD4 competitive because lets be honest, they are the only people that will have a valid opinion on what a map needs. Everyone else should just be made to play it, simple as that.

Then a deadline should be placed once the final beta has been released, then just implement that after that deadline.
Would be nice to have an updated version tested by some experienced players.
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Quote from Sie on the 13th of August 2011:
I just wish all stock maps were in promod rotation. Would bring alot of depth to the game. :<

A lot of the stock maps would have been unplayable at a competitive level.

Overgrown
Showdown
Assault
Wet work
Shipment...

Those maps where not selected for a reason. They have been tried and tested and just didn't work.
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Quote from SNWZY3 on the 13th of August 2011:
There should be specific guidelines to how maps should be created

Myself and aced spoke about this the other day, every stock map it's pretty easy to see how they flow, each spawn has 3 main choice routes to take that will lead to a central area of the map, the side routes should have "links" to the central area, be it through alleys or buildings it's not important. There is always a way to completely circle the map as well to allow for flanking, bomb site placement is debatable, if too balanced it could lead to a minor stalemate situation with both sides trying to get some early frags before pushing. An attack biased map would lead to early plants (sometown had a different A bomb site that allowed for plants within 20secs) forcing the defence to come straight out and into the action, SNADZ commented on how this could help quicken up the overall pace of the game and make it more exciting to spectate. A defence biased map could lead to large half time score differences that only even up towards the end of the game and make for a predictable and boring game.

Quote from SNWZY3 on the 13th of August 2011:
There should be a panel of about 15/20 people testing the map, who are high up and have had years (and I mean YEARS!) of experience playing CoD4 competitive because lets be honest, they are the only people that will have a valid opinion on what a map needs. Everyone else should just be made to play it, simple as that.

This would be a very good idea and would give the map creators a proper feedback response other than "too flat" "dont like it" "will never work", the only way to see what a map is like is to PLAY IT, screens and videos are good to show off how it looks and routes but you'll never learn anything about the flow without playing and finding "spots". A panel could vote on a maps compatibility with competitive play after testing then put ideas forward to the creator on how it could be improved/changed/balanced.

Another idea would be to organise a team of mappers that can work together and help get maps made quicker, layout designers, terrain editors, prefab builders anything that can assist getting an overall project completed and ready for competitive play faster than just one person trying to do everything.
At the end of the day we could have 10 new maps coming out per month but regardless of what anyone thinks about them without the proper backing and forced inclusion into map pool they will probably just fade and die like 99% of other custom maps. People want new maps but never like the new maps, catch22 much.
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Indeed, if the mappers came together and formed a team this would be a good idea, but I'm not sure how the software works and don't know if you can put the pieces together like a jigsaw. More like painting a picture.

I would rather go through 20 custom maps and get 1 map that works, with time that would lessen as the mappers know what works and what doesn't. I'm not saying they "should" be cracking out 20 maps in 6 months because let's be honest, keeping the game fresh lies in there hands and I admire the talents they have in being able to work with the software and actually try to help the community push forwards.

I was thinking, maybe have one person design a map, on photoshop or whatever, forward that onto a designer, cutting out the design process for the mapper.

Conversing between a team of 2 a designer and the actual mapper might work a bit more effectively, removing one role from the the mapper. Obviously the majority of the work will lay on the mappers shoulders, so I would think that the designer would pick up the changes and then alter the design accordingly.
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Quote from SNWZY3 on the 13th of August 2011:
but I'm not sure how the software works and don't know if you can put the pieces together like a jigsaw.

Yes you can put pieces together so to speak, with mp_sometown i spent the first two weeks just creating the buildings, then it was a matter of organising them into a rough layout before working on the terrain. As all the buildings were prefabs you could just move entire sections at a time rather than having to select everything used for it before moving and risk messing something up in the process.
The mapping tools are not overly complicated once you grasp the basics and i would recommend anyone to just install and try them out, after first using them i never looked at a map in the same way again, it was all brushes, terrain patches and models and it helps you understand how they are created, all it takes is one idea. At the moment all the maps we play are dirty, rubble strewn areas, but what if someone put out a "clean" map, a new town uninhabited and untouched, would people like it or just think literally, too clean. A hell of a lot is based on look, if someone doesnt like the look of a map why should they be inclined to try it.


Quote from SNWZY3 on the 13th of August 2011:
I was thinking, maybe have one person design a map, on photoshop or whatever, forward that onto a designer, cutting out the design process for the mapper.

Conversing between a team of 2 a designer and the actual mapper might work a bit more effectively, removing one role from the the mapper. Obviously the majority of the work will lay on the mappers shoulders, so I would think that the designer would pick up the changes and then alter the design accordingly.

This is how i will be working on my next project, but, it is helpful to have others around you that can help when needed, even if it's just something simple, that group can be there to back you up and help cut the time down.
The more ideas we can chuck out the more it can be looked into and maybe we can come out with something solid that will benefit the whole community and bring in more content to keep it alive and fresh.
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Quote from honeyzhhh on the 13th of August 2011:
+1

Could have a thread explaining how to install the maps on the server as well, we've got cluster on the server but for som reason it would make people download it even if we're not playing on it.

I think the maps which should be added are cluster and backlot_fix for now, although marketcenter is looking really good.

Imo urban and hideout are unplayable
Same happens to us. You need to restart the server everytime cluster is played. This way people only have to download cluster when you play it. There should be a better way about this so if anyone knows please tell me
Also agree on the maps. Hideout isnt that good.

OT: Get some experienced players to test cluster and give their opinions. Then make a final version. Try to get vita-nova and mennace to arrange another showmap on cluster. But this time let two top teams (not mixes) play it against eachother. If it is good, just accept it into the map pool. Contact lots of cup admins to force it into the first or second round. The best thing would be to get it into the mappool on a LAN.

It would also be good to get it finished asap as it got loads of attention atm. When its finished just force it and after a few moths or so, if its more unplayable than crossfire just throw it out again.
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Seems like a good idea getting these deployed to server companies. Hope it happens soon.
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in my opinion theres allready a development like this .. the team i play with time to time alleady added hideout/cluster/dunham to all their 4 servers <.<
i realy think more hosters should do this . new maps would bring kind of fresh tactic and stuff in cod4..
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